Tools Understanding Engine Oil

Discussion in 'Tools & Equipment' started by honda_saj, Saturday 13th May, 2017.

  1. honda_saj Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    Not my own write up by the way taken from various websites

    What I discovered, is that oils, both dino and synthetic, are vastly different, in both their basestock and their additives. These differences contribute to differences in performance.

    The API classifies oils into five different groups.

    Group I base oils are the least refined of all of the groups. They are usually a mix of different hydrocarbon chains with little or no uniformity. While some automotive oils use these stocks, they are generally used in less demanding applications.

    Group II base oils are common in mineral based motor oils. They have fair to good performance in the areas of volatility, oxidation stability, wear prevention and flash/fire points. They have only fair performance in areas such as pour point and cold crank viscosity. Group II base stocks are what the majority of engine oils are made from. 3000 mile oil changes are the norm.

    Group III base oils are subjected to the highest level of refining of all the mineral oil stocks. Although not chemically engineered, they offer improved performance in a wide range of areas as well as good molecular uniformity and stability. By definition they are considered a synthesized material and can be used in the production of synthetic and semi-synthetic lubricants. Group III is used in the vast majority of full synthetics or synthetic blends. They are superior to group I and II oils but still have limitations. Some formulations are designed for extended oil changes. AMSOIL XL Motor Oils, Castrol Syntec and many others fall into this category.

    Group IV are polyalphaolefins (PAO) which are a chemically engineered synthesized basestocks. PAOs offer excellent stability, molecular uniformity and performance over a wide range of lubricating properties. AMSOIL SAE Synthetic Motor Oils and Mobil 1 primarily use group IV basestocks. PAO is a much more expensive basestock than the highly refined petroleum oil basestock of Group III.

    Group V base oils are also chemically engineered stocks that do not fall into any of the categories previously mentioned. Typical examples of group V stocks are Esters, polyglycols and silicone. Redline uses an ester basestock.

    In the 90s, Mobil filed suit against Castrol for falsely advertising Syntec oil as synthetic, when in fact it contained a Group III, highly hydroprocessed mineral (Dino) oil, instead of a chemically synthesized (group IV or V) basestock. Due to the amount that the mineral oil had been chemically changed, the judge decided in Castrol's favor. As a result, any oil containing this highly hydroprocessed mineral (Dino) oil (currently called Group III basestock by the American Petroleum Institute) can be marketed as a synthetic oil. Since the original synthetic basestock (polyalphaolefin or PAO) is much more expensive than the Group III basestock, most of the oil blenders switched to the Group III basestock, which significantly increased their profit margins.

    When I was trying to decide between Royal Purple and Redline, I discovered AMSOIL. What impressed me about AMSOIL was that it used the same basestock as the stock Mobil 1 (Group IV PAO basestock), but used oil analysis reports showed AMSOIL used higher levels of detergents and anti-wear additives. This was somewhat confirmed when Mobil 1 came out with their Extended Performance Mobil 1. When Mobil 1 came out with this new product, at the time they claimed that it had about 50% more detergent and anti-wear additives than the regular Mobil 1.

    What turned me off to Royal Purple were several poor used oil analysis reports I reviewed, and the fact that they did not say on their website what type of basestock they used. Other companies such as Redline, Mobil 1, and AMSOIL were very up front with their basestock, so I wondered what Royal Purple was trying to hide.

    My research indicated to me that Redline was (and still is) a very good oil, but I was somewhat concerned that its basestock was Group V, an ester basestock, and I'd read a few bad reports.
    0W-30
    0W-40
    5W-40
    Fuel economy savings
    Enhances engine performance and power
    Ensures engine is protected from wear and deposit build-up
    Ensures good cold starting and quick circulation in freezing temperatures
    Gets to moving parts of the engine quickly
    Semi-syntheticCharacteristics
    5W-30
    10W-40
    15W-40
    Better protection
    Good protection within the first 10 minutes after starting out
    Roughly three times better at reducing engine wear
    Increased oil change intervals - don't need to change it quite so often
    MineralCharacteristics
    10W-40
    15W-40
    Basic protection for a variety of engines
    Oil needs to be changed more often
    W= Winter cold viscosity Number= hot viscosity
    The full ACEA specs are:

    • A1 Fuel Economy Petrol †
    • A2 Standard performance level
    • A3 High performance and / or extended drain
    • A5 Fuel economy petrol with extended drain capability †
    • B1 Fuel Economy diesel †
    • B2 Standard performance level (now obsolete)
    • B3 High performance and / or extended drain
    • B4 For direct injection passenger car diesel engines
    • B5 Fuel economy diesel with extended drain capability †
    † Not suitable for all engines - should ONLY be used in engines specifying this fuel efficient grade. Refer to the manufacturer handbook of contact your local dealer if you're not sure.

    Mineral oils:
    • E1 Non-turbo charged light duty diesel
    • E2 Standard performance level
    • E3 High performance extended drain
    • E5 (1999) High performance / long drain plus American/API performances. - This is ACEAs first attempt at a global spec.
    • E7 Euro 4 engines - exhaust after treatment (EGR / SCR)
    Part / full synthetic oils:
    • E4 Higher performance and longer extended drain
    • E6 Euro 4 specification - low SAPS for vehicles with PDF (see below)
    Low SAPS diesel (Sulphated Ash, Phosphorous, Sulphur):
    For diesel engines fitted with a diesel particulate filter (DPF) - a filter unit in the exhaust that takes out the microscopic soot particles. Regular diesel oils used in engines that have a DPF can cause the filter to become blocked with ash.
    • C1 Low SAPS (0.5% ash) fuel efficient
    • C2 Mid SAPS (0.8% ash) fuel efficient, performance
    • C3 Mid SAPS (0.8% ash)
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    Not in rating order just a list of good oils @oilman @K24 CL9 GUY @Mugen_fd2 and any other members can elaborate

    Top Rated Oils:
    Amsoil Signature Series 0W-20 (Group IV basestock)
    Mobil 1 0W-20 (Group IV basestock)
    Fuchs Titan SuperSyn Longlife 0W-20 (Group V ester oil basestock)
    Millers Nanodrive CFS 0W-20 (Group V ester oil basestock)
    Motul 300V Power Racing 0W-20 Ester Synthetic Racing (Group V ester oil basestock)
    Redline (Group V ester oil basestock)
    Gulf Competition (Group V ester oil basestock)
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    @Mugen_fd2 could you post your review on gulf competition and others from list you have tested please would be much appreciated
     
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  2. Mugen_fd2 Valued Contributor ★ ★ ★ ☆ ☆

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    I will try to make some photos each time with oil change and condition of the oil and overall impression.
     
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  3. honda_saj Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    Excellent thanks :Smile:
     
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  4. Mugen_fd2 Valued Contributor ★ ★ ★ ☆ ☆

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  5. K24 CL9 GUY Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

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    A very interesting read thanks @honda_saj with the chart below it's clear why Performance Autoworks used Mobil1 0w40 in mine but I am wondering if worth switching to 5w30 for the extra protection and longevity? 3 times better at reducing engine wear is quite a statement.
    Screenshot_20170513-192051.
     
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  6. honda_saj Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    It really depends how you drive I am running 5w30 but always let my car warm up before driving and I don't throttle hard until fully warmed. For those who believe it's a myth or can't be bothered they would be better off with 0w30 or 40

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  7. honda_saj Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    Also what oil filter are you running ? @k24cl9guy

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  8. K24 CL9 GUY Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    United Kingdom Guy Gloucester
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    I always warm my car up before I drive it and always have with all my vehicles :Smile:

    I'm currently running the K&N fast flow filter but thinking of going for an uprated OEM one next time round like the FN2 one. What would you advise? The Hamp ones get good ratings also.
    - - - Updated - - -
    I also never run it low on fuel and always fill up with Shell V-power :Smile:
    - - - Updated - - -
    My Nissan Almera I had before the Accord was ramped every day of its life for the six years I owned it but with taking care of it like above with only using V-power, always warming it up before driving and two oil changes a year with decent fluid it never skipped a beat.
     
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  9. honda_saj Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    @k24cl9guy

    Thats scary how similar your post is too what i do and the fact we both had almeras before.

    Warming up is important although internet and manufacturers say you don't need to with modern vehicles, i don't believe them and understanding of engines tells me until oil comes up there will be no protection.

    Oil Filter: Hamp or Hamp shortie (htune)

    Shellvpower is very good fuel you should participate im petrol survey https://h-tune.co.uk/club/threads/member-help-needed.181951/live i find it to be the best performance and MPG also jet fuel is same standard.

    Never had my nissan almera fail on me in fact i have not had breakdown cover for years maybe sometime in 2000 was last time i had breakdown cover, look after your car and it will look after you.
     
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  10. K24 CL9 GUY Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

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    Ha ha well just two people that love and care for their motors and also have a good choice in cars :Smile: I much prefer the peace of mind that the engine is warmed up first especially as I have a lead foot :Tongue:

    I too have never needed recovery and I agree that V-power is brilliant for performance as well as economy. Once in my Accord I went to fill up and they had ran out of the good stuff so filled with standard and got quite alot less miles out of a full tank.

    I'm sold on the filter then as @andy83 also recommended the Hamp one. Just what oil? Stick with the same or go for a different brand and or go 5w30?
     
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  11. honda_saj Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    Mobil is good oil however according to their website you should be running 0w20

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  12. honda_saj Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    My personal preference is amsoil as it the only true fully synthetic oil out there amsoil signature series opie oils will have in stock by next month

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  13. K24 CL9 GUY Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

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    I noticed that in your original post all the best rated oils said 0w20.
     
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  14. andy83 Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

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    @K24 CL9 GUY mate hamp short used on Honda engines so feel there good:Niceone::Thumbup:, mate 5w30 I also find good..
    thanks
    andy
     
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  15. K24 CL9 GUY Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

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    Might have to give the amsoil a try in 0w20 then me thinks with the Hamp filter :Thumbup:
     
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  16. honda_saj Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    Amsoil and hamp shorty then you will copying me again we just need to find out who bought their almera and honda first rofl [emoji23] [emoji23] [emoji23]

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  17. Mugen_fd2 Valued Contributor ★ ★ ★ ☆ ☆

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    Hamp is a good filter.
    IMG_0172.
    @K24 CL9 GUY I think 5w-30 5w-40 is a good choice for your powerhouse. 0w20 designed for economy, will be too thin and won't provide needed protection IMHO .

    When I change oil next time I try Hamp or 15400-PLM-A01(similar to Hamp) and will try to cut current 15400-PCX-004(S2000 filter). Just to see how it looks inside as some people claim its the best filter, but I met video on youtube and I didn't like what I see.
     
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  18. K24 CL9 GUY Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

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    Yeah someone did say to me I need to run thick oil for the SC set up so better not go too thin might give Amsoil 5w30 and the Hamp shorty a try then. What was up with the S2000 one mate?
     
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  19. Mugen_fd2 Valued Contributor ★ ★ ★ ☆ ☆

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    Quality of the assembly was poor, filter element not straight, black silicone/glue was poorly applied. 3 out of 5 his score and this guy is reputable reviewer.
     
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  20. honda_saj Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    @Mugen_fd2 totally agree sound advice there

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