The really, new PC build begins

Discussion in 'Technology, Gaming & Phones' started by Heckler, Saturday 22nd Dec, 2018.

  1. Heckler Club Moderator Club Staff

    Last year I did a mini refresh/upgrade on my old PC... to try and make it last another year or so. Give me time to save some money for a brand new build.

    Well... it's begun.

    So far I only have the case, Power supply and a 1TB SSD, I'll be ordering an All in one liquid cooler over the xmas break.

    Then as a temp measure, I'll be transferring my current PC into the new case... Whilst I make up my mind on final components.

    You see I was going to get a Ryzen 7 2700X, on an X470 chipset motherboard and 16GB of DDR32000mhz memory.

    Then AMD leaked that the new 3rd Generation Ryzen 3000 series would be out around March/April with a new X570 chipset to take advantage of new features.

    Whilst the 3xxx series of CPU's will work in the X470 boards, I wanted to wait... Otherwise I'd have ordered almost everything already... Just another few months... Hence swapping the motherboard into the new case.

    So here we go...
    PSU is an EVGA 650W fully modular 80+ gold certified unit. EVGA get very highly rated, and I tend to use Corsair in the past, so this is my first EVGA one. 650w should be more than enough to run the system, and leave me more than enough headroom to add extra drives and so forth.
    2018-12-22 17.19.40. 2018-12-22 17.20.27.

    I struggled to find a case that was suitable... I didn't 'have' to have a glass side panel, but I wanted a decent full tower, with plenty of room for radiators and cooling. But it 'MUST' have a 5 1/4" bay for a bluray drive and either built in SD card reader & USB3 sockets.. or a second drive bay that could be used as a 3.5" bay for a card reader to be fitted. You'd be surprised how hard it is to find a decent case that meets those requirements these days and doesn't cost £150.

    So after buying and returning several that 'claimed' to have features I needed but didn't... Like the one that had 2 front RGB fans and a glass side panel.. that had a flimsy plastic side panel and fake vents on the front... and no upper venting at all.. I settled on the Sharkoon BW9000.

    It's got everything I need, is modular too... so you can remove drive bays for better airflow.
    2018-12-22 17.19.59.
    The tempered glass tinted side panel... Not really that bothered about it. Not going to be doing a load of lighting in there... I'd rather spend that RGB money of higher quality/faster components.
    2018-12-22 17.21.48.

    Side panel off... First problem encountered... One of the little thumb screws that hold the glass in place was missing. Not a big deal, I can get a spares... and you'll understand later why I'm not going to return it for another.

    The middle 3.5 drive bay can be removed... allowing the one of the front 140mm fans to blow unimpeded into the case, the lower fan will cool the drives. (which will be at least one 1tb SSD and two 3TB mechanical ones).

    Side panel off, loads of room inside for full ATX boards the upper drive bay can be removed allowing one of the 140mm front fans to blow unimpeded into the case, the lower fan will cool the drives.
    2018-12-22 17.22.10.

    All of the cages are tool less ones, unclip and pull them out, drives clip in place on rubber spring grommets... So those mechanical drives won't transfer vibration noise into the case.

    Top filter is magnetic, so slides right of for easy cleaning and access... the top plate has room for up to a 360mm radiator... I'll be fitting a 280mm one.IO ports are 2x USB 3.1, 2x USB 2 and Audio in/out. I may not even hook up the USB2 and audio as my audio outputs over TOSlink to a 7.1 amp in my office. I may actually look into replacing the USB 2 ports with more USB 3.1... As the motherboard I buy will probably have 2 USB 3 headers onboard, failing that I have a PCI-E USB 3 card I can reuse from my current system (as that has no USB 3 on the case at all).
    2018-12-22 17.22.38.

    Power supply intake filter slides out quick and easy for cleaning.

    2018-12-22 17.22.57.

    The 1TB Crucial MX500 SSD
    2018-12-22 17.23.20. 2018-12-22 17.24.04.
    And installed in the case.
    2018-12-22 17.25.13.

    Now for the reason I couldn't be bothered to return the case... All of these parts I purchased through Amazons Warehouse deals... and I saved a load of money. That SSD rrp is normally £200, but typically can be found around the £160-170 range... I paid £110 and I've literally just ordered a 2nd one this evening. So that's 2TB of SSD's for the new build and I'll also be adding a 500GB M.2 drive for the OS and essentials, but will buy that with the MB as I can't test it right now.

    In addition to the missing thumb screw on the glass panel, one of the rubber grommets on the rear of the case was missing.

    2018-12-22 17.27.21.

    Now normally these retail around the £85-90 mark, I paid £55... and I've emailed the company to ask if they can send me the missing bits. Everything else was included, but the box had some minor damage... the case however was in perfect condition. I suspect that some one bought it, found it wasn't suitable for their needs and returned it.

    The PSU normally retails for around the £95-100 mark, I paid £80... and it's been tested and works fine.

    So in total I've saved between £120-160... Which was enough to pay for that second SSD. :Smile:

    I'll update the thread as the build progresses.
    Last edited: Sunday 23rd Dec, 2018
    honda_saj, legend-ary and DrSam like this.
  2. DrSam Club Moderator Club Staff

    United Kingdom Sam Birmingham
    Looking forward to see the build
    honda_saj likes this.
  3. Heckler Club Moderator Club Staff

    Second 1TB SSD installed, new Sata cables arrived too. Wanted some shorter black ones with locking mech.
  4. Nighthawk Club Manager Club Staff

    Its about time for me to upgrade mine as well. As some of you know, I have built mine into my desk with a custom watercooled loop. The i7- 4790k has served me well, but I've been eyeing up a 9900k i9 Coffee Lake for a little while. My GPU is still more than powerful enough, so my upgrade with be some more DDR4, a new MB - looking at a rampage this time around so that I can install motherboard waterblocks as I have never done motherboard WC cooling before and I have more than enough architecture already installed to support it all. Got over 12tb of main storage between my computer and the home network NAS servers in which the CCTV system runs etc. Lets see what the new year sales bring. Another reason to make the wife even angrier than she already is :Whistle:
  5. Heckler Club Moderator Club Staff

    Picked up this little baby in the Xmas sales... £20 off. I also picked up some corsair RGB fans to make it push/pull on the rad and throw some light into the case... Only to find that the 'controller' that comes with the fans... isn't compatible with the Corsair iCue software and to get one that is... another £48. So the fans went back and I'll grab some unlit ones instead. I don't really care about RGB lighting in a case, I find it pointless really. But I already use the software with my mouse/keyboard, so adding the AIO cooler and a couple of fans wasn't a big deal. But I am not spending stupid money on another controller on top of the one I already paid for just for some silly lights... I'd rather save the money and put it towards getting 32GB of ram instead of 16GB. :Smile:

    2019-01-02 17.04.43.

    I also picked up some new arctic silver thermal paste and some new locking SATA cables (some flat, some right angle).

    So this weekend, everything goes into the new case... and the old case goes to my mum... then I'll be pulling it all out in a few more months when the Ryzen 7, 3xxx series hits the shelves.
    honda_saj likes this.
  6. Heckler Club Moderator Club Staff

    I've been waiting to see what AMD would announce this week at CES... and sure enough, the new 3xxx series Ryzen will be released... but not until the middle of the year.

    So as I wasn't prepared to wait that long... I've revised my build a little... and will upgrade again towards the end of the year.

    So last night I ordered the Gigabyte B450 aorus pro ATX motherboard, because it's considered one of the best around... I know the MIS one is rated better, but it doesn't have the voltage offset for proper precision boost... So overclocking potential is limited. I saved £50 by going that route.

    Instead of the Ryzen 7 2700X, I went instead for the Ryzen 5 2600X and saved £115.

    I went to buy the 16GB of Corsair Vengeance DDR4 3200mhz ram... only to find it was listed for £279.99.. FOR 16GB.. I didn't want RGB ram, and I've used Corsair before and it's decent stuff and uses the Samsung memory dies. So what I ended up with was 32GB or the exact same memory for £229.99... Yeah.. that's right £50 CHEAPER FOR TWICE AS MUCH.

    I then threw in a 250GB NVME WD Black M.2 drive... it's 3 times faster than the WD Blue Sata M.2 and only £13 more expensive... Doesn't make sense not to get one, things will be lightning fast.

    So why did I change my mind and go for a lower spec system... Because towards the end oft he year, I will replace my mediaserver rig with this one, and get the newer Ryzen 3xxx series and the X570 motherboard.

    Sure it means spending another £300 or so, but Windows 7 is end of life in Jan 2020, so I'd have to upgrade my mediaserver to W10 anyway at some point... so why not upgrade the hardware too. If the news is accurate and the Ryzen 5 with be going 8/16 core/thread and the Ryzen 7 will be going 12/24 thread and 16/32 thread... at the same price point they currently are.. I'll simply get the lower end Ryzen 7 or the high end Ryzen 5.

    I can buy both motherboards and both CPU's for roughly the same as what it would cost to buy a single Intel motherboard and the 8700k or 9700k CPU.

    I'll be giving my mums PC an upgrade with more than double the speed CPU and 4 times as much ram, as well as larger case with better airflow as her's tends to overheat a little... and I'll sell on my old parts to recoup a few pounds.

    Parts arrive tomorrow... just need to download a Windows 10 Pro image and get a license... I hate W10, but if I want to game properly I have no choice.

    So I may be off-line for a few days, whilst I build it, install windows and swear at it a lot as I install all the tweaks and software required to stop the MS data harvesting.

    This evening, I shall be running a final backup of my data and cloning my raid setup onto a single drive, just in case... this MB has onboard video, so I can actually leave enough hardware in there to boot it up onto a spare monitor if needed.

    honda_saj likes this.
  7. Heckler Club Moderator Club Staff

    Parts arrived... missing the ram. Checked with amazon to see if they shipped it separately and they immediately resent it, and it's arriving tomorrow.

    But I couldn't wait to start building it... So... this is as far as I've got.

    2019-01-12 15.25.17.
    2019-01-12 12.06.09.
    2019-01-12 15.15.11.
    2019-01-12 15.15.29.
    2019-01-12 15.16.24.

    I don't know why this pic is upside down... The pic isn't upside down on my PC, but every time I try to upload it... upside down it is. Happened on another site too, Very, very weird.

    I made some major changes to the original build... Based on the news that AMD will be releasing the Ryzen 3xxx series around July... I couldn't wait that long, but I scaled back my plans and later this year (Nov time) I will get another MB and CPU to rebuild my gaming rig, and transplant this board/CPU/ram into my HTPC Mediaserver build.

    The build wasn't without issues... getting that 280mm rad with fans in was tricky... it's only got a couple of mm to spare above the drive cage, and that also meant flipping it so the pipes are on the left... Most people do them on the right. But as I have a BDrom and 3.5 Mem card reader to install, it would have meant some very tight bends in the pipes, and I didn't want to do that.

    M.2 is an NVME WD Black... 3.5 times faster than a stock SATA M.2... This puppy will fly. Then throw in a couple of 1TB Crucial MX500 SSD's for games (I have rather a lot)... and when I dismantle my current rig... I will remove 2x 3TB HDD's, the BDrom, The RX580 Grpahics card and the card reader and the PCIE USB expansion card.

    Because I scaled back from the X470 board to a B450 one... I didn't realise that meant having 1 few USB header and 1 fewer USB3 header on the board. So once I've plugged in the USB3/USB2 headers from the case, and the USB header from the Corsair H115 Pro AIO... I've not got a header left for the memcard reader... Hence the need to remove the PCIE USB3 expansion card from my current rig.

    I've also ordered 2x Corsair 140mm Magnetic fans for the front of the case and a 120mm magnetic fan for the rear. These are whisper quiet PWM fans to go with the PWM fans on the AIO. So this thing will be really, really quiet. The fans on the vid card will be the nosiest thing in there., and that idles at 10% and never really gets above 50-60% under gaming loads.

    Once the ram arrives, I can power it up and install windows... I've got a flash drive with W10 Pro ready to go, just need to purchase a license. But I don't want to register the license, until I've tested and got this thing bedded in... as I'll be adding extra hardware and don't want to screw up the install by making a load of hardware changes... You can run W10 unactivated in a cut down home edition for free... and I can hook the system up to my TV in the lounge via the onboard video for initial setup and testing.
    Last edited: Wednesday 16th Jan, 2019
    legend-ary and SpeedyGee like this.
  8. Heckler Club Moderator Club Staff

    So the new PC is fully built, up and running and working ok... I have run into a minor issue that I wasn't aware of... and I don;t know if it relates to ALL boards or is a quirk of this one.

    Using one of the M.2 slots... Disables TWO of the sata ports.... WTF!!! I could understand it disabling 1 port... but two of them... That's ridiculous.

    I was going to transplant this board into my mediaserver at the end of the year... But now I have a dilemma.... If I remove the NVME drive and clone the OS onto the SSD... windows may consider that a hardware change too far and void my license.... Or I can add PCIE SATA expansion card and could have windows consider that a hardware change and void my license.

    Or I clone the OS onto one of my SSD's now, hope for the best... and return the NVME drive for a refund.

    I also discovered that if I add a drive to the 2nd M.2 slot... it disables a further 2 of the SATA ports... I am not amused.

    But it looks pretty and flies along really fast.
    2019-01-13 15.32.24.

    That's before I installed the proper graphics card... that's an old 5670 I used for testing and initial windows installation.
    honda_saj likes this.
  9. honda_saj Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    United Kingdom saj east london
    looking very nice makes me want to build one let me sort out car pc next lol :Happy:
  10. Heckler Club Moderator Club Staff

    I started to gather the parts for an in car PC back in the mid 2000's, but then things went awry with some deaths and I ended up selling them on for some one else to build it. I picked up a top of the range tomtom with a built in 20GB hard drive, so music and satnav was taken car of... and all of my cars since then have had satnav installed.

    Gaming results are in... I was struggling to play Assasins Creed Origins on 1080p, lowest settings and maxing out at 40fps with dips into the mid/high single digits... Stuttering was awful.

    I'm now running it in 1440p, settings on ultra and getting a constant 45-50fps with ZERO stutters and only the occasionaly dip into the mid 30's.. Perfectly playable... But I wanted to push a little more. So 1080p, high settings... and I'm hitting 70+FPS... and as my monitors are only 75hz...higher frame rates aren't going to be much more of a benefit.

    Then I tried The Witcher III, and wow... 1440p, ultra settings... everything cranked up to max inc the hair effects and 55-60fps.

    It's late, and I'm still installing software and games... some games I was able to revalidate the files I had... some should have been placed in a sub folder of a sub folder rather than the upper sub folder (Thanks Steam for that stupidity).. So a laod of games had to be downloaded again rather than resynced... Uplay on the other hand... Every single game resynced and validated first time... But you have to do them 1 at a time, which is annoying.

    So those are the only two games I've tried so far... Will try some racing games later this week... I'm expecting well over the 120fps mark there.

    And all that on a video card Sapphire RX580 8GB that cost me £102.50 brand spanking new... Now that's what I call value for money.

    I just might save up and get an RTX 2060 later in the year, as this card is nearly 2yrs old and I typically replace my video cards every 3yrs
    - - - Updated - - -
    Oh and first steps into over clocking are in... Stable at 4Ghz across all 6/12 cores with no voltage tweaks... and with all of the 5 fan profiles set to silent... So you really can't hear any thing from this PC at all.. the vid card fans when gaming are the noisiest thing... Occasionally the fans spin up for a few seconds and then back down again. But stress testing the CPU with silent fan profiles... only reached 58ºC.

    When the cores are turbo boosting... they're hitting nearly 4.5Ghz... in fact a third of them are hitting 4.51Ghz, and the other 4 are hitting 4.45Ghz.
  11. SpeedyGee Club Manager Club Staff

    England Speedy Birmingham
    Car PCs aren't worth considering any more as you can get very decent touch screen system, a lot of them based on Android systems, so you got a whole host of apps you can run.
  12. Heckler Club Moderator Club Staff

    I was actually looking into the possibility of mocking up a tablet in a frame, that would sit in the dash on my old MX6... But it would need to be removable and I lacked the skills to fab something up... This was before 3D printing was a thing... These days it would be quite easy to find a file online to make a frame for one, or to create one yourself.

    But only worth doing, if you are playing with a older car... and some of those have space for a double din unit... so no need really any more... I wouldn't trust those chinese clone things... Heard to many bad things about quality, and from my experience with anything I've bought from china like that... it's pretty much garbage that breaks after a few months, and you can never get it fixed or a refund.
  13. legend-ary Club Moderator Club Staff

    United Kingdom Legend The Big Smoke
    you got some sweet deals on the case and SSds! damn.. the build looks great, not too much RGB Bling..
    one question, does the overclock affect the life of hardware? im sure it does, otherwise why would all used listings claim 'never overclocked'
  14. Nighthawk Club Manager Club Staff

    Depends on how they were overclocked, to what level and how the heat cycles were managed. Overclocking isnt necessarily a bad thing, just as tuning your car isnt, its only bad depending on how well it was done (or not done)
  15. Heckler Club Moderator Club Staff

    It can shorten the life of hardware... but we're probably talking about it last 8yrs instead of 10. I've been overclocking PC's & graphics cards for 20yrs... Only ever had 2 failures... Both down to failed motherboards and both of those were back in the 2000's.

    My last 3 builds were a Phenom II 955BE that was clocked from 3.2Ghz to 3.75Ghz for around 4-5yrs, then the FX 6300 that was clocked from 3.5 to 3.9ghz for 4yrs and for the last year or so an FX 8350 clocked from 4Ghz to 4.4Ghz.

    I don't go extreme on my overclocking, but if I can get a 10-15% boost, I'm ok with that... and this is probably the best cooled PC I've ever built.
  16. Heckler Club Moderator Club Staff

    Overclocking results are in after 5 days of testing and tweaking... Results are pretty good.

    So stock is 3.6Ghz with a 4.2Ghz boost... I'm Running 4.1Ghz on all cores and it appears stable... I've had a few crashes and a few CMOS resets due to the eco settings lowering voltages.

    Temps are stable with a max of 66ºC recorded, and that's with fans and pump on silent mode, so the whole system is really quiet. These Ryzen CPU's are good to sit at anything up to 90ºC whilst under heavy load... obviously not for 24/7 use... But she idles at anywhere between 35-45ºC depending on ambient temps.

    I've been tweaking the graphics card too... with mixed results. I can get great improvements in memory speeds... up from 2000mhz to 2230mhz, but the GPU clock is only up from 1366 to 1440Mhz... and that can get close to 75-80ºC under heavy load. So I think I'm at the limit of this card, it's a mid range one, so I was never expecting it to be great.
  17. Heckler Club Moderator Club Staff

    A week further one and some more tweaking... I was introduced to a piece of AMD software called Ryzen Master... designed to get the most out of these CPU's... and boy is it good. So I reset everything in the bios and allowed the program to tweak everything except the memory. It's managing voltages, core clock, overboost and temps.

    So stock speeds are hitting 4.3Ghz, up from 3.6Ghz... But the overboost is hitting 5Ghz on 3 cores when required and 4.8Ghz on the others... and it's only over volting it from 1.4v to 1.47v. But the temps are the best part with this liquid cooler... 67º under stress.