Accord/7th Gen Rebuild or Write Off?

Discussion in 'Project & Modification Logs' started by Heckler, Monday 10th Jul, 2017.

  1. Heckler Community Staff Club H-Tune

    Had my first real accident today... car is damaged by kinda drivable with a slight vibration from the front wheel that took most of the impact. Door, mirror, sill are all scraped but repairable, wing is toast, bumper is a little loose and the wheel is going to need a refurb (luckily not one of the two I refurbished last month)... what damage is done underneath is at present unknown, but it ripped the undertray in half and left it dragging and there's other stuff on the underside that could have been damaged. That said, I was able to drive it the 6 miles home albeit a lot slower that usual. Kept it to no more than 45mph even on 60-70mph roads... thankfully there's a few villages and some dual carriageways, so I wasn't holding up traffic.

    Thankfully no visible injuries at the time, although I am currently suffering from some pain in my neck, shoulders and upper back.. my head was thrown side to side in the impact... the damage looks minimal to mine, the BMW that hit me came off far, far worse... I took some pics of that if you want to see them.

    Fault wise is unclear for certain... poor road markings and a design layout that's different to every normal dual carriageway roundabout that I've ever drive round before... and I come from Milton Keynes so that's hundreds of the feckers driven around tens of thousands of times over 26yrs of driving.

    Normally, every other roundabout I've been on that has 3 lanes going onto the roundabout from a dual carriageway onto other dual carriageways is as follows.

    Left lane, Left turn or straight on
    Middle lane, straight on
    Right lane, Right turn.

    I was in the left lane going straight on... the BMW was behind me and accelerated to go past me 'On the roundabout' and turn left... in MK that would have been clearly his fault and dangerous driving... but this is some new road layout with new roads being built and inadequate signage... the left and middle lanes are apparently for turning left only. But the only markings that appear to show this are the ones 3ft from entering the roundabout itself and a drivers eyes should be looking out for oncoming traffic not staring at the road... and it's one of those junctions where 2 lanes go into three without warning 10ft from where you stop. It's a terrible junction... So to me it's 50/50, me for not knowing the layout of a new road I've never driven before and him for driving like a twonk and trying to overtake around the outside of another car on a roundabout... I can say for certain that I wasn't indicating to turn left and he was behind in the same lane (at least 10-15 meters back according to my mirrors) as we came up to the roundabout... So to get alongside me means he floored it.

    My dash cam shows everything, but only in front, and he was behind and hit me from the side... But you can see how close I can to hitting a sign post on the central res of the dual carriageway. In fact it appears to have scraped the mirror as there's a big scrape on the outside edge/

    It's all down to the insurance now... car is valued at around 1800-2000, so providing the repair bill isn't going to be more than around a grand I'm hoping it can be repaired.

    I'm not likely to find another one of these for the money I paid, or will get from the insurance. If they write it off... after excess I'll be lucky to come out with between £1600-1800. Where am I going to find a 10yr old CTDI Tourer EX for that money... I know mine is currently now 12yrs old, but it was 10 when I bought it and I don't see the point in trying to get another PFL model that's only going to last a year or two. Might as well get one that will see me through at least 3 or 4yrs like this one would do (if repaired).

    Buy back may also be possible providing I can get it cheap enough... door, sill, mirror can be fettled and repainted... new wing and bumper if lucky can be found second hand for a sensible price... it all depends on damage behind the wing and underneath the car. If suspension or steering needs repairing... probably not worth it... and the hunt starts for a replacement. In that case hoping I can find a 2006 or 2007 facelift tourer EX for the same as I paid for this one.... and this one was almost mint for £1650... albeit with 156k on the clock. Not worried about high miles if single owner and full service history like this one had.

    Call the insurance in the morning, find out about a courtesy car and get it assessed for repair or write off...

    Also need to see the doctor as this eveing I'm feeling pain in my neck, upper back and shoulders from my head being thrown side to side.

    2017-07-10 18.20.45. 2017-07-10 18.37.54.
  2. SpeedyGee The Invincible Admin Club H-Tune

    England Speedy Birmingham
    Sorry to hear you were involved in a accident. Main thing is you seem to be mostly OK. Hope the neck and shoulder pains settle quickly.

    As for the car, I imagine that there would be some suspension damage at least and wouldn't be surprised if the impact has affected the steering rack too.

    If it's only common suspension components like bent tie rod ends etc then it would be simple fix.

    Personally though I'd be tempted to take the money and look for something else.

    As for liability, irrespective of road signage, it seems to that the BMW cut across into your path and therefore caused the accident.
    legend-ary and DrSam like this.
  3. StuH Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

    United Kingdom Stuart Lancashire
    Will end up being knock for knock I suspect. BWM driver will argue you were in the wrong lane but BMW driver performed a dangerous manoeuvre. End of the day, if BMW driver had practiced correct road sense it wouldn't have happened. Anyway, you're okay and it's metal and rubber that can be replaced. Good luck with the cold calls over the next few months "sir you have been injured in an accident" etc etc.
    DrSam likes this.
  4. Smokingman Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

    United Kingdom John LN5
    Personal if that was mine I would see about repair on the proviso that there in no major suspension miss-alignment/damage, and how handy with a spanner you are. Obviously parts could come from a scrap dealer and just get a spray shop to fit/paint them.
    DrSam likes this.
  5. Heckler Community Staff Club H-Tune

    yeah, it's probably 50/50 in my opinion, I was unaware of the new road layout due to it being recently rerouted and reconfigured... Ironically... the new layout meant I SHOULD HAVE TURNED LEFT instead of going straight on... Typical. He was driving too fast and without paying proper attention to other road users. My late father gave me some great advice when I was learning to drive... "Always expect every other driver to do something unexpected that goes against what roads indicate should happen." so I should have expected him to drive like that, as I'd seen him come screaming down the slip road onto the A14 a couple of junctions earlier... Found it on the dash cam footage and he almost swerved out to cut me up as I was in the outside line to give traffic from the slip room to pull out. He had to hit the brakes as he didn't have enough room to cut in front of me and I reckon he was trying to get past me at the first opportunity he could.. because traffic going the speed limit was obviously too slow for him. When you're more concerned about putting your foot down and overtaking, you're not paying due care and attention to other road users.

    Yup, if he'd waited a couple of seconds until he had made the turn onto the dual carriageway, rather than try to overtake on the roundabout itself... he would have been behind me still... sure in that case I would have cut across him to go straight on, but there wouldn't have been any contact. It's not like there was much in the way of other traffic going in our direction, so overtaking at a safe spot is the only way to do it.

    Until I find out if it's repair or write off... no idea... this car would have seen me through a couple more years I would have hoped... Not sure how I feel about repairing a cat d or c car as it will seriously damage it's trade in value. If they write it off, I've got a £250 excess to pay.. typically this years insurance starting on the 17th drops to just £150 excess. But last year my dad was seriously ill and in hospital so I didn't bother looking for other quotes and just accepted the renewal... this year I did and managed to get a better deal inc 100k legal cover for £3 less than last year... and £45 less than they quoted me. I could have got it another £20 cheaper but without the legal cover and I'd rather have it.

    Got a docs appt this afternoon for a check up, and the insurance will be arranging for me to see one of their docs in case I need any pyhsio or massages to ease the problems. I've told them they cannot pass my details onto any ambulance chasers, which would be a data protection breach.

    Still a little shaken and my neck, shoulders and upper back are getting stiffer as the day goes on. Popping tramadol every 4hrs for the pain at the moment... front rear impact would have been better as my headrest would protect me, but this was a side to side impact first them front/rear as I went up the kerbs.

    If they determine it's uneconomical to repair... I probably won't see any more than £1500-1600... and any hire car I have will have to go back within a few days of it being paid out... So I really need to looking into car purchases now... Please keep your eyes peeled for a tourer EX around 2006-2008 that's around the 2k to 2.5k range. service history essential, fewer number of drivers the better... with those two mileage isn't as important so long as service history has been kept up to date preferably by Honda.

    Just got off the phone with the insurance and without even looking at the car they're going to class it as a total loss. Fingers crossed they payout the full amount less my excess. I've said that if they agree the value was 2300 as I had it insured for that amount... I'd gladly accept £2000 after excess is taken off. I can get something with that I hope.

    They were going to class it as my fault until I objected and pointed out what they thought was me swerving to avoid the other car, was actually the impact of him hitting me... So they're going to try and classify it as 50/50 which is fine with me.

    Also sent them the footage of him coming onto the A14 far too fast and having to hit his brakes because of the car in front as he almost pulled out in front of me. Might help my argument that he was driving to quickly and not paying proper attention.
    DrSam likes this.
  6. StuH Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

    United Kingdom Stuart Lancashire
    Is diesel a must?
  7. FirstHonda H-Tune's Counsel The Evangelists

    United Kingdom Ed Wiltshire
    Really sorry to hear about your accident @Heckler

    Like you, I'm baffled that an increasing number of new road layouts ignore the accepted 'rules' of the road, and then don't give enough warning or signage to prepare drivers. Good that you have the dash cam footage though, especially if it shows the other driver was driving poorly leading up to the accident.

    Like @SpeedyGee if the insurance offer is acceptable, I'd take the money and buy something else.
    DrSam likes this.
  8. Heckler Community Staff Club H-Tune

    Unfortunately, it's front facing only camera and he hit me from the side... so there's nothing to actually show how fast he was going... the pic of his car shows his airbags deployed whilst mine weren't. I heard his engine revving high and he closed and tried to overtake me in a very short space. Clearly he was travelling much faster than I was. I accept my side of the incident, he needs to do the same... whether my insurance will fight for 50/50 for me or not is another matter... It kinda feels like they just want to wash their hands of it as quickly as possible... by writing the car off they don't have to supply me a courtesy car or anything else... if the car was undriveable, I'd be screwed.

    If anyone hears of a decent tourer ex... please let me know... I'm off to ebay and autotrader to look at average prices.
    - - - Updated - - -
    Not essential, but it is easier on the old wallet in terms of MPGS as well as cheaper to tax & insure.
  9. FirstHonda H-Tune's Counsel The Evangelists

    United Kingdom Ed Wiltshire
    Would you consider a CR-V? If nothing else it would open up additional possibilities.
  10. Heckler Community Staff Club H-Tune

    I'm open to all suggestions... even non Honda ones... I do have a fondness for Japanese motors, and need something that my 72yr old mother can get in and out of easily... yet is more of a top end model with leather and a decent stereo system. Really need bluetooth these days but satnav is optional as my phone is more than capable of it if connected to cars system.

    I was just looking at this one...

    Honda Accord 2.2 i CTDi EX 5dr

    it's about 30-40 miles away, and if they paid out 2k after excess for mine, it's within budget as my mum's offered to loan me upto 1k and I'll pay that back like I did with this one... I'll also have tax to refund as there's 9 months left from August and I may be able to get something that's cheaper on insurance.

    If the insurers look at autotrader for prices... they're gonna have a hard time because cars my age and specs are going for anything between 1400 and 2600
  11. Heckler Community Staff Club H-Tune

    @FirstHonda I've been looking at the CR-V, MPGS are a fair bit lower, tax and insurance a lot higher. At least an extra £50 a year to tax on top of an extra 20-30% of fuel over the course of a year.. I've not idea what the running & maintenance costs like for them either.... I'd certainly consider one, but it would have to be top spec, and very cheap to do it for me.

    Are the FR-V's any good... seem to be similar in height to the CR-V but better economy, only 30 a year more to tax and insurance group is similar to mine.

    Looks like a really pokey amount of boot space though.

    Whilst I'd prefer the tourer... wouldn't say no to a 2.4 saloon if the price was right... if I'm gonna pay more for fuel and tax... might as well make it really worthwhile. :Smile:
  12. Heckler Community Staff Club H-Tune

    What about a Civic CTDI EX hatch... not the biggest fan of the shape, and it's a little smaller that I thought... depends if my large backside can fit comfortably in it as I've got rather long legs too. But the diesel MPG's look sos much better and tax is £45 cheaper than the accord.

    Honda Civic 2.2 i-CTDi EX Hatchback 5dr
  13. FirstHonda H-Tune's Counsel The Evangelists

    United Kingdom Ed Wiltshire
    Based on your high level criteria, I'd certainly look at a Mondeo estate and a Toyota Avensis estate.

    You'd likely get a newer model than with a Honda, and from what I read both have a strong reputation for reliability.

    More of a risk - repair wise - would be a Volvo V70. Nice cars though.

    Heckler likes this.
  14. Heckler Community Staff Club H-Tune

    My previous car was a Mondeo Ghia X and it was an unreliable worthless piece of crap... Paid 2100 for it in 2012 and over the 3.5yrs I owned it spent over 1500 in repairs... Never passed an MOT without a £200-300 repair bill... so I'd NEVER buy another... and that 1500 doesn't include tyres, services and fluids.

    Aside from looking really bland, the Avensis estate is on the list or potentials... was looking at them at the same time as I bought the Accord... comfort and reliability are the most important things along with not costing me much more to run than the current one.
    Last edited: Tuesday 11th Jul, 2017
  15. DrSam H-Tune's Counsel Club H-Tune

    United Kingdom Sam Birmingham
    @Heckler sorry to hear about your accident.

    Hope you get what your looking for.
    I would suggest to decline the first offer the insurance company gives you and explain to them that your Accord didn't fail MOT and doesn't require any major work because it's well looked after. After that, they normally bump the value.
    When i had the accident in my FR-V, i bought the car back although it was a cat c, only because I knew it was well looked after and put it back on the road.
    If i go to sell my FR-V, i may not get much, but the way i looked at it was, I got paid out, bought my car back, repaired it properly and pocketed some money. Meaning I'm driving a free FR-V.
    Insurance company i was with used Glass Car Valuation. They valued the average price of the vehicle that sells in the UK.
    BB Baboonface and Heckler like this.
  16. Heckler Community Staff Club H-Tune

    It's looking more and more like an Avensis will be a good choice... might get lucky with a T Spirit, T180 or T150 as i think those have most of the toys, leather, electric everything and some have satnav but it's not important... the T180 isn't too shabby with a 177bhp turbo diesel lump in it either. :Smile:

    I must also confess that I love the Alfa 159 tourer, especially in black with red leather interior, the 2.5 diesel is quick too... But it's an Alfa and I can't afford to keep repairing it during ownership.
    DrSam likes this.
  17. Heckler Community Staff Club H-Tune

    Toyota Avensis 2.2 D-4D T180 5dr

    Now if I get the full payout for mine, I could afford this right away and still be able to part out the accord to cover any immediate repairs and maintenance that's required.
  18. legend-ary Community Staff Club H-Tune

    United Kingdom Legend The Big Smoke
    Sorry to hear about your accident but glad to hear that you are ok!
  19. Heckler Community Staff Club H-Tune

    Last night I was emailing back and forth with Nighthawk... he's been offering advice and suggestions on potential cars. We've both arrived at the conclusion that the Toyota Avensis T180 or T Spirit would be the most practical and economical solution. Finding anoter Accord would be my preferred choice, but finding a suitable EX Tourer within my potential budget... Would be far harder.

    As the shock of the incident has worn of I've got a little more annoyed with my insurance dismissing my car as a write off, I got the feeling from the way they spoke they were doing it more to avoid giving a courtesy car to save them selves money. So I emailed them last night, said I wasn't happy and that I wanted the car assessed, and if the cost of repairs was less than 66% of it's value (and they agreed to a £2300 value when I took out the insurance)... then if the repairs were less than £1500 I expect them to fix it. Otherwise I expected the full settlement amount of £2050 to be paid within 24-48hrs (less the £250 excess). perhaps they shouldn't have told me the exact cut-off point they use to determine economical repair... I just pointed out their own rules/guidelines on the subject. :Smile:

    They called me this morning and have arranged to have the car picked up tomorrow and assessed... and if it's repairable a courtesy car will be provided. If they deem the car uneconomical to sort out, I'll accept it... But I really hate feeling like I'm being ignored and dismissed by companies in that way... It's 100% certain to get my back up. I should know either by the end of Thursday or mid Friday.

    I've also been inspecting the video and pictures I took... and recalling the incident over and over in my head... It's started to become clearer that the actual impact between us was more of a glancing blow that a blunt one. Most of the damage to the BMW could have been caused when he's struck the kerb at a far more acute angle than I did. I've also noticed that the drivers side front wheel bounced up the kerb first at a lesser angle and the passenger side front wheel struck the kerb at a similar angle 3ft further on.

    I added some txt to the pic to illustrate
    2017-07-10 18.37.54(txtinfo).

    So I'm starting to think that the majority of the damage to my car is cosmetic... Everything depends on if there is any suspension or steering damage underneath. Fingers crossed it's just the undertray that needs replacing.

    If they say there's no damage to the bottom of the car... but still want to write it off... then it's making me more likely to repair it myself. A wing and perhaps a bumper, the door, sill and mirror just need some sanding, filling and painting as well as the wing if second hand and a different colour. No glass or lights appear to be damaged, I need to go out tonight and double check/test all bulbs.

    The BMW is to the right in this picture just out of frame... and because of the far more shallow angle he would have struck the kerb he did and the greater speed he was carrying.. I think that's far more likely to have caused the more severe damage showing on his car.

    I'm now crossing my fingers that they repair it as I don't want to lose it really... I've just refurbished two wheels and was going to do the other 2 next month, I've just restored the headlights and the car is otherwise in really excellent condition and has been well looked after by both owners (I'm only the second owner) with full Honda Fleet history to 152k and then serviced at 162k plus new discs, brakes, tyres all round, new rear callipers and a lot of TLC... It's too good a car to throw away if I don't have to.

    So cross your fingers guys... Ideally I'd like this car to have lasted me a couple more years at least before changing it (I tend to do that every 4yrs or so as most cars I buy are 9-10yrs old at purchase, which is why I always get a top spec one).. If it can be repaired it will be.

    if I repair it myself, I'll throw in some new front shocks and springs too for safeties sake.

    I'll also have to phone Adrian Flux as Monday afternoon I got my renewal done to start from the 17th July and paid for the year.. One of the questions asked was 'any claims' in the last 5yrs... to which the anwser was of course no... this incident happened later on that same day. So I didn't lie, but because the new years insurance starts on the 17th... I need to find out if that needs to be cancelled and redone to reflect the claim since.

    If only I'd waited a few more days, that wouldn't be another thing to sort out... but if only is all I'm thinking at the moment.

    If only the road had signposts to warn drivers of the new layout
    If only they had signs to warn that it was a non standard junction
    If only I had known the new layout
    If only the other driver hadn't been young a foolish
    If only the other driver hadn't been accelerating hard to overtake some one on a roundabout

    If just one of those things had been different, it might never had happened.

    Tempted to write a strong letter to whichever council is in charge of that junction demanding better signage to warn drivers of the dangerous lane flow assignments. Having a 2 lane road turn into 3 without warning, and with only 10-15ft from the junction (it's barely long enough to contain 2 small cars or one large like mine) a middle lane that turns left in that manner is ridiculous and only encourages people to try to overtake over vehicles whilst on the roundabout itself... A much better solution would be to have a left only feeder lane onto the other dual carriageway... like you see all over the country. It's an accepted and safe way to do it as proven by the greater reduction in accidents at those points. The middle and right lanes can then be for the other 2 exits on that roundabout. Hey presto, a far safer roundabout and fewer accidents.
    Last edited: Wednesday 12th Jul, 2017
    honda_saj and BB Baboonface like this.
  20. BB Baboonface Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

    United Kingdom James Chesterfield
    Keeping them crossed for you Heckler buddy, terrible that an innocent mistake got turned into this by some aggressive idiocy on the part of another driver.
    If possible i'd make sure you get a copy of the report and double check the findings yourself, or get a second opinion if you think they are pulling the wool.

    Surely any damaged suspension or even steering components can be replaced fairly cheaply and easily, probably by some decent parts from a breakers.