Engine & Gearbox CTR vs ATR

Discussion in 'Honda F/H-Series' started by ben bury, Thursday 12th Dec, 2013.

  1. ben bury Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Been having an argument with a few mates as to which would you buy. Either a prefacelift EP3 as they are less than 3 thousand now. Or an accord Type-R.


    If you was to buy one now which would it be? And why?


    Will update with some hard stats later as we all love stats.
     
  2. mikecivicvtec Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Depends what you want it for. I've had a couple of EP3's and I loved them. Never owned an Accord though.

    Wouldn't know which is quicker either. A lot of people mention the gearboxes on ATR though so make sure you check everything over at all rev ranges, You may get a crunch in the gearbox at high RPM shifts.
     
  3. Turkish Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    I prefer the EP3 but there is no doubt that an ATR is a great car. ATR would be cheaper to buy but the EP3 would probably be more reliable in the long run and accept more abuse before giving up
     
  4. Kyron Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    United Kingdom kyron Wolverhampton
    7,987
    39
    h2b the ATR but thats if you was to mod it

    facelift ATRs had the gearbox issue resolved from what I heard

    ep3s are good though not had a chance to drive oneproperly as when I did I was learning how to drive lol
     
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  5. mikecivicvtec Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Fuck it, put a Mondeo gearbox on it
     
  6. ben bury Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    This is going the way I thought it would. Looking at a fair few youtube vids the EP3 is faster, just.


    If the Civic had a LSD I think there would be much less of an argument.
     
  7. Shiny Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

    A fair few people go from a CTR to an ATR, but very few go from an ATR to CTR, so that may answer your question :Wink:

    The ATR is a bit more grown up, after all, an Accord is an old man's car :Smile:

    To me the ATR feels more of a car and I much prefer the shape of the ATR to the CTR.  But each to their own and I fully respect that someone could feel the same was about the CTR.

    I've upset a few CTRs in the past and I'm sure I will be upset by a few CTRs in the future. 

    The only problem with the ATR is the 5.8k VTEC spot, you have to change up from a fraction of second within the rev limiter to keep it in the happy zone.  You often end up either bouncing off the limiter or dropping to just under 5.8k so it falls out of VTEC.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Thursday 12th Dec, 2013
  8. RandomDan Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Also worth noting people no doubt have a lower opinion of the CTR for being a yob magnet.

    From what iv seen arnt all hondas driven while banging on the rev limiter?

    After being to a couple of honda meets it certainly looks like it!
     
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  9. Shiny Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

    Lol, I was subtly trying to say that the ATR is less chavvy.  Body kits and shit are pretty much scorned upon by the owners.

    Twats at meets and normal drivers are different things.  My old 4G Lude kicked in at 5.2k and it was easy to keep it in VTEC through the gears.  Changing gears in VTEC in the ATR is a precision exercise and you feel a sense of achievement when you get it right.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Thursday 12th Dec, 2013
  10. Hamza Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    My EJ2 never saw the limiter...  :whistle:
     
  11. MichaelWhiteLocust Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

    I echo everything Shiny has said! Also, ATR is a much better looking car IMO...

    9B2EEA83-E18D-4009-9207-5443AF85CF62_zpsjgsqc6xe.

    E97068DD-3AD2-4387-97E5-E90F0854EC62_zpsnvfyu0wp.

    73908308-4DF0-4BCE-AE23-DA24A9B450D9_zpsb5tpkqfi.
     
  12. Kozy Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

                                     ATR                                CTR

    Steering                   Hydraulic                        EPAS  (no feel)

    Front Suspension    Double Wishbone           MacPherson (worse handling)

    Rear Suspension     Multi-link                         Independant trailing arm  (worse stability)

    LSD                         Yes                                 No (More understeer/worse handling)

    Weight                     1320kg                           ~1250kg  (Not that much lighter)

    Power                      209bhp                           197bhp  (Less)

    Torque                    159lbft                            145lbft   (Less)

    ATR is a better car, period. Sure, the K20 and 6 speed box are nice, but they don't make up for the rest of the shortfalls.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Thursday 12th Dec, 2013
  13. mikecivicvtec Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Does not being able to rev higher then 3k have anything to do with that ;-)
     
  14. Kyron Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    United Kingdom kyron Wolverhampton
    7,987
    39
    H2B ATR over UKDM EP3

    JDM EP3 over ATR

    EuroR over JDM EP3

    thats how I see it anyways
     
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  15. Kozy Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    H2B ATR? That would be retarded.
     
  16. Hamza Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Well, that was 4,000RPM but it was still a limiter...
     
  17. Kyron Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    United Kingdom kyron Wolverhampton
    7,987
    39
    why ?

    better acceleration

    cost is abit up there but will be worth it
     
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  18. Kozy Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    H2B is a method of dropping the H22 into a Civic. It would be flat out pointless in the Accord. If you want shorter gearing, why would anyone in their right mind change the gearbox, mounts, shifter linkages and driveshafts, when they could simply swap the FD?

     

    You know the ratios are nigh on identical to the S4C right?
     
  19. BenL Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

    My mate bought an ATR the same day i bought a CTR.

    The CTR just about has the legs on the straight, but its proper tight. On roundabouts though the CTR has the advantage. Having driven both the CTR feels much tighter and nimble, but it is the smaller car.

    Its mainly down to looks really. I prefer CTR all day long (expecially pre-facelift)
     
  20. Kozy Club Veteran ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Drivers, tyres and alignment are in the mix, the ATR should really be able to corner a fair bit quicker, all else being equal.

    The ATR is essentially a scaled up DC2. The EP3 is more like a Golf with VTEC.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Thursday 12th Dec, 2013